Bipolar Depression

M,

What you say about your guy is just like mine. They can "pretend" to be this fantasy man online - like they are playing a role. I think I told you that my guy told some stranger in Paris that he saw her in his dreams before seeing her online. He hadn't so much as spoken to her yet. It was in his second email to her. He told me that nothing came of that, but I was concerned because this was the same type of thing he was writing to me.

After inviting me to come to his state for a week, I noticed that he was still checking into the dating site twice a day. I shot off an email to him saying that I didn't think it was appropriate for me to travel to another state to visit a man who was still "looking". He told me that he didn't think the dating site had anything to do with me, then blamed me for hurting and rejecting him. This was the first red flag of cognitive distortion, a BP symptom. He was the one looking for others, yet when I called him on it, I was hurting him??? He took down the profile and everyone talked me into giving him a second chance, so I did. And, now look where that got me.

Now he's changed his dating essay 3 times in the last month, first reading like an angry letter to me about how happy he is with his life (he referred to his relationship with me as his "break" from the dating site), then changed it to ask women to "feel his aura" and now it reads "if you want to laugh, have fun and enjoy life, email me". This is not a "fun" man. Not even when he was hypomanic, was he fun! I loved him for his sensitivity and vulnerability, not because he was a laugh-riot. He is playing the "surgeon" card by using a picture of himself in scrubs as his primary pic. He doesn't sit on the web all that often. He checks in for a few minutes a couple of times a day. I think he spent an hour or so a couple of weeks ago, emailing women - and is now waiting for the responses. I think he calls them right away - he knows he has this incredible sexy voice that they all will fall for.

On a doctor review website, his patients ALL describe him as "robotic" and "humorless". One even mentioned that she was distracted by the funny hat he was wearing. He liked to wear hats, but I didn't know he wore them in a hospital setting with patients. He was in the perfect specialty. From what I read, patients expect a surgeon to be "quirky" and "stiff".

Mine also had a fantastic ""radio quality" voice. Very seductive. Well, that changed too. It became cold and mean.

I am still waiting for the BP guy to come back on here and answer my and givenup's questions.

Regards.

This post really spoke to me. As a child with a BP mom, I can really relate to all this....the meaningless apologies, and constant victim/attention-seeking complex...the constant feeling like I was the crazy one because she always made me feel guilty for being upset. The abuse. I'm now 4 months pregnant with my first child (her first grandchild) and everyone thinks I'm nuts for not wanting her to be alone with the child when it's born. I agree that children cannot deal with BP people, and also, BP people cannot deal with children. At least my mother can't.

Mystified: I wanted to say that at least your guy let you know what was wrong with him after a short period of time. I also agree that I think that they use the internet to play out a fantasy that they can't live in real life. A therapist that my husband went to said that she thought that my husband was seeking out women on the internet because he didn't have any social skills. Like your guy Chatty, my husband is estranged from his family (they are pretty abusive and dysfunctional...I suspect they suffer from mental illness as well), has NO real friends except the people he works with, and typically isolates himself from others because he said he doesn't trust people. I figured out that he doesn't have friends because I don't think he could hold himself together long enough to develop a healthy relationship with others. I think he shys away from people because he is terrified that they will realize that there is something wrong with him. Also Chatty I think that part of the reason I fell for my husband is because he appeared to be sensitive and vulnerable. He wasn't the fun guy that he portrayed himself to be. Out of all the years we have been together, the only time we do things fun and exciting together is if make plans for it. When I realized that my husband wasn't this sensitive vulnerable person he pretended to be boy did he get angry. I told him that it wasn't flattering at all that he plays a victim role in order to get people (especially women) to care about him. I told him that someone may initially enter a relationship with him for that reason, but always being a victim gets old. Also like you Chatty I found out my husband was looking for other women on the internet. I'm thinking that he is with me and professing his love to me and telling others how wonderful I am while he is on the internet looking for other women. When I confronted him he broke down crying telling me he wasn't doing that when I had proof. He even had the nerves to say that I was hurting him by making such an accusation. He's always the one doing wrong in this family but he is always the one to claim that he is hurting. Kat I agree with you though I could be wrong, I don't think my husband is "endlessly reviewing his life". I think that if he had any clue of how much damage he has actually done he would have consistently entered treatment by now. I think that he believes or at one point believed that I had no other choice but to tolerate his behavior. I'm sure he is shocked that I walked away from him and decided to let him deal with his misery, depression, and manic episodes on his own. Oh and I also meant to say that my husband would always fabricate the truth to seem sensitive and vulnerable. I just could never understand how he felt it was ok to build friendships or any relationship based on lies. Its obvious to me that he likes the role of victim......after all these years I'm beginning to think that is the only identity he knows. Kat or other significant others of bps do you ever wonder or have you figured out how your bp became so comfortable with you that he/she showed his/her true colors? In other words do you thin that there was something about you that they felt they didn't have to pretend anymore? Without meds will bps condition continue to deteriorate?

Hi all,

Back after a hiatus. It's hard for me to be here on this site, and I have to do it in small doses. I read all of the posts. All are so well thought out and so many are heart rending. I'm going to take some time to think about them. In the meantime, I came across Proverbs 19:19 and the gist of it is that if you try and save an angry person, you will only have to do it again (and again). Something to think about with regards to the Sisyphean challenge of bipolar relationships.

Take care,
G

Hello all,

G, thanks for the biblical reference - it is so true about angry people - all the love in the world can't save them. I also don't think BP's are endlessly reviewing their lives - I think they have selective memories and just move on when things don't work out. I don't think they take any responsibility at all. They "tune out" and call it a day. I think the guy on here who says that they are "reviewing" is young and we are dealing with older people for whom the disease is more severe.

Mystified & givenup: If I had not found this board and read all of your posts (especially yours, Mystified), I would still be in a state of shock and disbelief over what happened.

The only other time someone has loved me with this much fervor and disappeared without a trace was 14 years ago. I thought I had learned my lesson then, but apparently it took another time. The two relationships were very different, however.

The first guy started getting weird almost immediately after I gave up my virginity to him (which was a week after he gave me a diamond tennis bracelet for my birthday). He did the "back & forth" thing - once he even cried on the phone because his "walls were going up". Like a stupid little fool, I went running over there and told him everything would be OK. Then he was intermittently nice and mean for a couple of weeks - eventually saying that "we crashed & burned" and that his walls were now up. There was no reason for us to "crash & burn" and when I said this to him, he said, "what's the difference, we did". Huh? He was never very communicative about his family or his past. He really had NO friends at all, which I thought was a bad sign. And, a crappy relationship with his parents, but he didn't say much, so I never knew what the real deal was. Yet, he was always talking about our future and what we were going to do together. He lived down the street from me (I know, yuck!), so I saw his comings and goings and, unless he was working on his next victim, he just stayed home alone every night. I watched this over a 10 year period. He only had 2 other victims during that time. I suspect he was depressed during the in-between times. He finally moved to another state and his realtor told me that some girl from across the country was moving in with him there. She thought it was odd that they had never lived together before and didn't know each other that long. That was three years ago. She probably went back home by now. Another victim - oh well.

This new one was different. He was very communicative and, initially I thought he had a good network of friends. Like I've said, he was very involved in the local religious congregation - he was V.P. and President of the men's club and head of a bunch of other committees there. During my 2 week stay with him, I came to realize that he really didn't have many friends. The only phone calls that came into his apartment during that time were for me. No one even called him on his cell at night or on the weekends. Other than some acquaintances who he thought kept in touch periodically in case they needed medical help, he really only had one friend, and she was a married woman who was also very active in the congregation, as was her husband, I always thought it was odd, however, that he was better friends with the wife. She was his confident, and apparently he was her confident as well - he gave her the "designation" of "Angel", just like he gave me. In fact, she was instrumental in fixing us up - she had asked my friend there if she knew anyone for him and my friend thought we'd be an ideal match. This guy didn't do any "back & forth" stuff - he went straight for it, until I started noticing that things didn't add up. Before I left to go home, he was acting quiet and somewhat weird, made a few odd remarks and once I was safely home and had one harsh conversation with him, he just said he needed his space and hasn't spoken to me since.

While they both spoke of things we would do in the future - the second guy was actually making arrangements - he arranged for me to look at rentals with realtors and he took me to all the congregation meetings with him and was joining me up to the Sisterhood there. He also introduced me to everyone in the medical office that took him aboard - and I think he had told them that I would coming aboard to work with him soon. They couldn't wait - they said he was coming in to work so happy since I had gotten there. I wonder if the other MD's he works with have picked up on the BP yet? He's only been there since July.

Guy #1 didn't have the obvious bipolar symptoms, but upon reading my diary from that time, I found that he had other ones. He used to do the "alliteration" thing - he'd get all enthralled with a series of words and keep repeating them. Like when we were making dinner one night with my dog in the kitchen. "Puppy, pesto, pinot noir" was the theme that night - so much so that I wrote it down in my diary - it was strange. He also was "bothered" by signage - Yup, billboards while he was driving would be distracting to him - and real estate signs. But, that was all I noticed. He seemed to sleep and eat OK and didn't smoke, drink excessively or take drugs - that's why I think this disease exhibits itself differently depending on the innate personality of the person who has it. He did go from "everything being great" to just being morose all the time - I was constantly trying to cheer him up towards the end. One day he came over with flowers because he had just signed a huge deal for a celebrity's insurance account and a few weeks later he was complaining about cash flow problems. Maybe he overextended himself? Or made a bad business decision? I even offered to lend him money to get him out of the dumps. Oh, and he had had a vasectomy. Now, what divorced, 41 year old guy who has no children, gets a vasectomy???? And, he had told me that he was only married for 3 years and that he got divorced because he was having an emotional affair with a woman at his office. That's all he would say about his marriage. I thought all of this was very odd, but he was so very nice and sweet to me that I just excused it.

Guy #2 was just a mess - smoked, excessive caffeine consumption, didn't eat or sleep, complained constantly and blamed others for everything in his life, excessive spending/hoarding, financial problems and a strange relationship with his kids. I think he had just come out of a depression because in the 6 month old pictures he showed me, he looked like a a concentration camp victim - and the shaved head only accentuated that image. But, he was depressed for good reason, he lost both his wife and his job in a 6 month period. So, the "victim"mentality and vulnerability made sense when I met him. Now he's 20 lbs heavier and grew his thick, curly hair out for me. He's gorgeous now! (I'm sure he's saying he was victimized by me - this bossy girl who came to town and, when she wasn't returning all his stuff, she was snooping on his computer. He's probably telling everyone how much he loved me and how I distrusted him - probably using it as the excuse for why he's depressed.)

So, you can see how different these two guys were and how confused I was when they both left after declaring such strong love for me. None of the bipolar info sites say that leaving abruptly is a bipolar trait. They talk about hypersexuality, rapid speech, high energy, reckless behavior, etc . These guys never showed those traits at all. NEITHER of these men were the "life of they party". They were both very quiet and introverted. From what I have read about bipolar, I would expect a BP sufferer to literally be "bouncing off the walls" - and that more likely describes ME!! I'm very ebullient, outgoing, friendly and talkative - always have been. The only initial evidence of their imbalance was their rushed courtship and then abrupt disappearance - especially given that they both had to overcome my apprehension to their romantic fervor. They both manipulated me into genuinely loving them and then just "poof" (as Mystified says), disappeared!

And, givenup - interesting how your guy had the same reaction as mine to my discovering his inappropriate internet activities. He said my suspicion and distrust of him was insulting and hurtful. Would you believe he also said that to me when he told me he wanted his "space"? I asked him why he needed his space and he replied it was to "work through" my suspicion and distrust (because of my past history - oh, and yeah - he knew the entire story of guy #1)- along with my "anger" about his children. (I did see something on his computer and on his cell phone that verified my initial suspicions of him wooing other women with the same flowery talk - I stumbled onto it and it was from before he met met - I wasn't looking for anything, but I 'm sure he's telling people I'm so damaged that I went through his computer and cell phone looking for stuff. Now, of course, I wish I had. I also wish I had examined his medicine cabinet and every drawer and box in that apartment!)

So, I thank goodness that I found these chat boards. It's mind boggling how these men have the same traits, accusations and excuses and even use the same verbiage! And, I thank all of you for continuing to tell me about your experiences and give me support. If not, I would still be wallowing in guilt over whatever I could have done wrong. What happened to me is NOTHING compared to what everyone else is going through. On another board, I am talking to a woman in England who has been with a surgeon for 18 years and one month after giving her a 4.5 carat diamond ring for their anniversary with tears in his eyes, he went manic, started drinking and running around, left her and now wants a divorce. She is pregnant with their 5th child. Talk about a NIGHTMARE!! I really feel badly for her. She says the instability started about 4 years ago, so I guess the theory about the disease progressing with age may be true. The more I read about other's plights with BP, the better I feel about being dumped.

However, I can't stop wondering, why Mystified and I were dumped when everyone else got married. The only thing I can think of is that everyone else married their BP SO earlier in life, before the disease got really bad. Maybe at that point in their lives, the BP's were able to make the commitment. I've read that the disease becomes worse and more difficult to manage with age because of the "kindling" effect. Mystified - didn't you say that your guy was married twice? My guys were both married once. I think guy #2 had a 17 year marriage because he married relatively young (34/35) and started having children right away. I also think that his ex-wife's family's money was a major factor in him staying with her for so long. I think he saw them as a cushion for emergency bail-outs and he liked all the fancy vacation homes and activities that became available to him. His folks were dirt poor. Plus, he may have cheated or had an emotional relationship - he says she cheated on him and he unwittingly paid for her to take vacations with her paramour. Who knows?

I hope I am done wallowing - I showered and washed my hair (it had been 11 days!) and stripped my bed, washed my sheets, replaced them and did two more loads of laundry. Tomorrow I will clean my kitchen and bathroom and try to get back to a normal life. I hope I don't "hit the wall" again.

I still think about him 24/7 because he wasn't just a guy - he represented an entirely new life for me, living and working together in a new state with the opportunity to really "build" a new life together, which is all I've ever wanted to do with a man. He was "starting over" again and I was just the woman to help him achieve his dreams. He made a BIG mistake not declaring that he had this problem. I think I could have dealt with it and not "triggered" him if I had known what I was dealing with. My last email to him was November 24th where I apologized for anything I did and literally begged him to just talk to me again - just as a friend, nothing romantic.

His answer was to put his dating profile back up with an essay which read like an angry letter to me. He left it up for a week so I would see it and then changed it. The man hates me now and the only reason must be "cognitive distortion" - where they hear or read something and completely misinterpret it and take offense. He's done it before when he became hurt and angry at me when he hadn't taken his dating profile down. He thought I was rejecting HIM when I said he could continue looking and that I'd still see him when he came to my town. I knew that was a red flag at the time, but everyone said to give him a chance!

Reading and posting on these boards serves as a continual reminder that I could have moved "lock, stock, dogs & barrel" to another state, rented my house out and be stuck there with the nightmare that some others are living. I was only going to go as a 3 month trial, keeping my house vacant during that time. What if he was able to keep it together for those 3 months (like a honeymoon period) and then went berserk on me after a year? It could have been so awful. I read on one of these boards that "whether or not there is a formal diagnosis, the disease still exists and is not going away" - a lot of people think if they "reject" the diagnosis, that they're fine and they 're not. Mystified, just like your guy, I'll bet my guy knows he has this and just thinks if he doesn't mention it that it will go away. Maybe he thought it would scare me away? He takes those heavy meds for a reason, and I'm not sure it's just for OCD. I've read that Lexapro is also used for BP. Then I think that maybe his shrink told him to get rid of me when I was causing him stress by wanting to discuss what I saw there. I can just imagine how it would have sounded. Oh, this woman who I loved had so many trust issues - she invaded my privacy and needed constant reassurances of love and berated me about my children, etc. She would be concerned with his sanity, not mine. But, I think he would just blame the shrink then, given how he liked to lay blame on everyone but himself. That would have been so satisfying for him to say "My shrink told me to let you go". What could I possibly have said to that? I'll never know.

I read on another board that some of the women can only deal with \the change in their partner by thinking that he died. That's how I feel. That the love of my life is dead. I finally met him and now he's gone and I'll never see him again. The life we were supposed to have together is never gonna be. That hurts less than to deal with the reality of the situation - that he's just a sick sadistic narcissist with no remorse or concern. I wonder what message the universe is trying to send me, given that this has now happened TWICE!

Here's hoping everyone has a good week - hang in there!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: chattycathy,

G: I had to look up "Sisyphean", but I think it accurately describes how one feels in a BP/non-BP relationship. Thank you for sharing that.

Givenup: Yes, I really do feel grateful (for lack of a better word) that he found it within himself to admit it to me. I never would have thought "Bipolar" because my previous conception (or mis-conception) of this disease was extreme mood swings; either being really happy or really depressed, which is obviously far from an accurate description. Only after reading extensively was I able to realize that all of his behaviors during that short time, that had me feeling so puzzled and confused, were in fact manifestations of the disease. Maybe his telling me was an act of remorse on his part and perhaps on some level he felt that by disappearing and removing himself from my life, he was actually doing me a favor (still wanting to believe that underneath all the devastation from this illness, there is still a good, decent man in there).

CC: Having read all these stories from people over the last couple of months, it never once crossed my mind why did I get dumped by this man, when everybody else on here got married. Would I have stayed with him had he admitted this to me earlier on, when we were actually dating? Well, I'd like to think that I would have been willing to give it a shot IF he demonstrated that he was compliant with his treatment, but that's clearly not the case for him. And even though I had fallen in love with this man, knowing what I know now, there's no way I would have entered into a marriage with him. I don't believe for one moment that I could have been the one to save him or rescue him from himself, so to speak. He's in his mid 50's and has evidently been living with this disease for many years but has chosen to deal with it the way he sees fit. I offered my support and even offered to be there as a friend after the fact, but clearly he doesn't "need that". I know this may sound kind of harsh or calloused of me, but I truly thank God all the time that it didn't go any farther. Even though I was hurt by the way he ended it, I have to believe (as I noted to Givenup) that he was actually doing me a favor--albeit in a distorted, backwards sort of way. A true blessing in disguise, if you will.

M,

I know it sounds crazy, but I would absolutely give my guy another chance if he ever saw his way to communicating with me again. He''d have to apologize profusely, exonerate me from whatever he told his friends about me, admit that he had this disease and arrange for me to attend his therapy sessions and participate in his treatment program. The chances of this happening are about the same as hell freezing over.

Although, when he was the "good" him he would talk about letting me handle all the finances "when" (not "if") we got married. He used to look at me forlornly and wonder outloud, "If I had married you 20 years ago, we'd be rich how, wouldn't we?" So, somewhere within this very damaged man is an introspective guy who knows he's screwed up his life and wants to do better. But, I don't think he's gonna let that guy come out again for a long, long time. And, I am so sick, because I miss him and need to talk to him and he doesn't really exist.

Yesterday was a better day than today. Throughout today, I lapsed into crying jags and thoughts of him still enter my mind 24/7. Even while I was picking up dog poop in my backyard. I get panicky when I'm just in my own yard or front lawn. And, being in my car even triggers panic - because I drove it all over the place in his city and I was panicky in it while driving home alone from there. I can only listen to one radio station because the others bring on an attack and I removed all the CD's that were in the changer during my trip with him. I'll never be able to listen to those again! Last week, the cable company sent a man out to do something for my TV and the guy was really nice, but I sobbed the entire time he was in my living room. I read it's something about being around strangers and part of the PTSD that I'm in the throes of. This is so odd for me - I'm normally so gregarious and outgoing.

The insecurity about the future is very disconcerting to me. Will I ever hear from him again? Sometimes I daydream about what I would say to him if he ever contacted me again. I imagine what he would say. I have these conversations in my head and can't concentrate on anything else. I think about how he will spend his future without me and imagine how my life will go on without him and how crappy it will be. What will tomorrow bring? I go off into the delusional dream world that exists in my head while all the time fighting the impulse I have to call up his wife (who I have never met) and get the real story behind everything. I wish I had never met him and wish that I had turned my back on him after seeing the first red flag. I didn't "fall" in love with him - I don't do that anymore. I made an educated decision to love him based on his goodness and sincerity which turned out to be based on faulty intel. (Kind of like when Bush invaded Iraq thinking there were weapons of mass destruction there! LOL) I allowed myself to feel love for him because of who he represented himself to be. And, he knew that I was moving mountains to allow myself to feel again. He kept telling me to trust him and "go with the flow" and everything would be wonderful.

There is a word for what I feel now. I found it on a website. It's called "derealization". You feel like you're living in a dream - like nothing is real. I felt like that that first time I flew into his state. In his car leaving the airport, I kept saying "this doesn't feel real", "I can't believe I'm in another state with you". It became OK once my friend there took me to lunch and I attended some events with my guy. I finally felt it was real when he flew here from a medical course in France and I met his parents and we drove back to his state together in my car. It was even real when he had his little outburst upon my finding out about his spending. Then, when I heard him on the phone that night saying he 'needed his space" - I was back into a dream world, only now it was a nightmare.

This is exactly like I felt 14 years ago, when another man did this to me. Ever since then, I've felt like I don't know what IS real from what is NOT. I can't trust my own judgement and I've been existing in a state of fear. I may only have 20 "good" years left on this earth and this guy 14 years ago did irreparable damage to me and he never looked back. I'm wondering if this latest guy will ever think about me or if I ever meant anything to him at all. He used to complain that his wife was never introspective and that he was.

Then I think that maybe I'm the one with the "cognitive distortion" problem and that he's this great guy who just turned off to me. But, then there are his symptoms. Then, maybe I'm reading too much into everything? I feel like I am going crazy. What these men do is "crazy-making". I wish I could just take a pill and know the truth. Know what was going to happen and why..

CC, your obviously don't understand what some of us are telling you. Even if he did all the things you outline in your first paragaph, it probably would not last. He might do all of that and mean it when he said it, but BPs have no natural control over their emotions. There are no "choices" here--it's all biochemical. For some, meds of various sorts work to control the emotions, and if they have no other emotional issues (childhood abuse, alchoholism, etc), they can lead "normal" lives as long as the medication works. For some, no medication works well; for others, a med may work for a while--and then quit. It's all a crap shoot--how an individual body chemistry responds.

Therapy doesn't work. You need a psychiatrist to monitor changes and change doses, add new drugs, etc. But trust me--they're all guessing. They try a variety of drugs and hope something works. You become the primary monitor. You spend your days watching the BP like a hawk, trying to determine if his/her emotions have moved one way or another, if he's really in touch with reality. Your life becomes ruled by the BPs behavior patterns--and your obsession with them.

In addition to BP, many have other emotional problems stemming from childhood environments or from years of emotional chaos within themselves. They long for a stable life, but many know their problems and are afraid to make commitments. They can rarely sustain a relationship of any kind long enough to have any kind of stability.

If you are involved with a BP without any kind of legal commitment, run, do not walk, to the nearest exit. If you insist on commitment, under no circumstances should you consider having children. In the first place, BP is probably genetic--any children or grandchildren you have also run the risk of the disease. I know a woman whose mother was BP--and so are two of her four children. Her life is a living hell. In the second place, even if they don't inherit the disease, those children will suffer emotionally from the sometimes chaotic relationships of their parents and may need extensive therapy to help them cope.

Don't even think about it!

Hi Kat,

I know what you say is true. Still, I would be willing to take the risk (I think). I am 52 years old and have never been married and can no longer have the children I longed for my entire life. He already has 3 kids. His two girls both have mood disorders, one is BP (she no longer speaks to him) and the other one only has ADD (so far). I know the one with ADD is medicated and has been for years - she is 14 now, the BP girl just turned 16.

If this man can ever go back to being the guy I fell in love with, I would be so happy. I never felt so loved, cherished and safe as I did when he was "that" guy. I never loved anyone as much or had as deep of an emotional connection. I was apprehensive at first, but he kept encouraging me to "trust him". He said everything would be wonderful. Of course, he's different now - it was sudden and he just "became" someone else - cold and detached. Literally disappeared from my life and won't even answer an email. This has only happened to me once before in my lifetime - 14 years ago and I'm still in recovery from that - I haven't been the same since. I've only loved 3 men in my life and two of them were BP - how's that for odds?

I know that what you say about wondering if they are living in "reality" is true. Whenever I was with him I felt like he was in some kind of fantasy. I found myself saying "I'm real - I'm here for you - you know that, right?' He replied that he wasn't expecting "some kind of fairytale", but something about him just wasn't grounded 1/2 of the time. He'd make plans, but sometimes they would only partially be thought through. He actually thought that my 3 dogs (one of which was a huge 80 lb beast) could live in his rented condo with us and his 3 kids who were there half the time. The condo was up a flight of stairs and my two little dogs have back problems and can't do stairs, so he said he would carry them up and down in the mornings to do their business. This man barely sleeps like it is and gets up at 6 am - I told him that this idea was just not practical and that we needed to rent a house - that's when he called the realtors and actually started looking for places for us to live (that he couldn't afford).

I am still in a state of disbelief that he has done this. I keep vacillating between feeling that he's either dead or is just on a business trip and coming back soon. I miss talking to him - I miss his friendship and support and just can't accept that he doesn't miss me. How can he not miss me? We were so close - he told me everything that was going on with him. (Although, one Saturday, I didn't hear from him all day - he lives in another state - and I finally called him at 11:30 pm to find out that he had been to a dinner party and was planning on calling me when he arrived home - but this was the first I had heard about the dinner party and he hadn't called me earlier in the day either which was odd because he didn't have his kids that weekend. He called me 4 times the next day to "make up" for it, but I still wonder if he was telling me the truth.) And, why did he parade me around, take me everywhere and introduce me to everyone he knows, including the entire medical practice (he told them I would be working with him there soon), if he was just gonna dump me a few weeks later? None of this makes any sense.

And, what I still can't wrap my head around is how these unstable men can go to work every day. This latest guy is a surgeon - how can he work if he's so unstable? He's pleasant and caring to his patients. Is that just an "act"? Do the doctors he works with know? How come he can be "normal" to them and at the congregation meetings and lead religious services while he's so cold to me, someone he professed to love and cherish as much as he did? Everyone thinks he is this kind, devout man and they feel sorry for him! This guy is not "the life of the party" - he is serious and quiet and not a drinker, druggie or ladies' man, like some of the others I've heard described on here. He just doesn't eat or sleep, lives on caffeinated energy drinks, smokes, has spending/financial issues, overextended himself with religious activities and was "over-the-top" in his spoken and written love for me and others that I found out he had written before meeting me.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: chattycathy,

Kat I want you to know that I agree with everything that you said to Chatty. I've pretty much lived that. Chatty I think that you should try to be more realistic about things and be glad the relationship between you and him is over. I'm saying this because if he caused you to feel this awful, could you imagine him repeating the behavior over and over again?? Why would you want to go through that again? I know the thought of all that he took me through, and all that he would continue to take me through if I allowed him really is not worth it.

I understand what you are saying in my brain, but my heart wants to believe that what it felt was not wrong. Some days I know that what happened is a blessing, then other days I just miss the "old" him something awful.

I miss feeling safe. I miss feeling loved. I miss feeling that my life was finally going to start. I have been waiting for my life to start for 52 years, with 3-4 false starts/disappointments under my belt. I thought this time was REAL. I thought he was sincere. I even once wrote a note to the friend of his who knows my friend and arranged the "fix-up" - I thanked her for introducing me to the "most beautiful and sincere man I have ever met".

As I have mentioned before, I am the child of a narcissistic, borderline PD mother (product of a one-night stand, so no father at all) and I also have some of the borderline traits, such as "not accepting reality" and "magical thinking". Plus, after expressing my apprehension to this man over and over again and trying to slow him down and telling him how scared all this was making me, I just can't accept that someone who seemed to love me so very much could turn so cold and do this to me with no discussion or explanation at all.

When I discovered things about him which were shocking to me, I tried to discuss them with him and that was the first time I saw the "cold" him come out. Yet, I did not leave HIM. I thought that there was enough about him was was so wonderful that I felt I could just deal with the other stuff. After all, as he reminded me, "everybody's gonna have something" and what he had really wasn't that bad at all. So, he wrote overblown romantic stuff to strangers? I had decided it was better to be with a man who was romantic with everyone, rather than one who couldn't be romantic at all, like my last boyfriend. And, at least he had "chosen" me. Or so I thought. So, he spend a few thousand on excess stuff he didn't really need. He has the potential of making millions, especially with my help and direction and marketing skills. He had told me that I could handle all the finances. And, he was so very nice to me most of the time. So sweet, so loving, so comforting. He just wanted to make everything "better" for me - he knew all I ever wanted was to have my own family and he told me that he would have or adopt children with me. I want to blame myself because then I can make it better. But, he won't communicate with me at all and the last time a man tuned out to this degree was 14 years ago.

That guy pulled up his carpet and did his hardwood floors because I had allergies while in his house. He gave me a diamond tennis bracelet after only knowing me 2 weeks. He measured my vintage stove to see if it would fit into the stove alcove at his place where he wanted me to move. And, then a few weeks later, he was similarly gone. He started picking fights with me over the placement of his armoire after the hardwood floors were done. Then it escalated to picking on me for blowing my nose in bed, which I did from day one. And, then it would be picking on me for the way I pronounce a certain word or an expression that I used - which I had been pronouncing and/or using from day one also. All of a sudden these things about me really bothered him to the point that that he would make me cry, he got so cold and cruel.

I'm also wondering if this latest guy would have disintegrated into that. Maybe if I had seen that behavior, this would be easier to accept. He had already started with that nasty remark over my offering to buy him a massage chair and saying we could have other "fun" in it (wink-wink). He replied in a cold tone, "So I'm no longer enough stimulation for you?". I was taken aback at the time, but let it roll off my back. Maybe he had a bad day at work or something?

There are videos of him on Youtube discussing surgery, and I watch them and look at him and hear his voice and think, did I really know this man? Was I really supposed to become engaged to him? It's like none of it ever happened. If I didn't have the photos and his wonderful messages on my answering machine to prove it, I would think it was just all a dream I once had. I also have photos and voice recordings from the guy 14 years ago, but this latest one was more intense. I mean, I was going back and forth to another state and he was coming here. I was looking at house to rent with him. How could it go from all that to NOTHING??

I'm confused? I thought these men just get depressed and/or drunk, have affairs and become party boys. This guy was not a drinker. In fact, I was the one who kept opening bottle of wine and encouraging him to drink because he always seemed so stressed out (and I certainly was). We drank something almost every night. And, I can't see him cheating - he hates his brother for cheating. Although sometimes people hate seeing something in others because they have the problem themselves. He is most definitely NOT a party boy. Very quiet and introverted.

I know all of you think I am this wimp, but I am a very tough cookie. I had an abusive boyfriend once and I excused his first "outburst" as stress, but when he did it again, I was outta there and never looked back. It was definitive! I knew what I was dealing with. The man turned purple and was smashing the phone against the desk - over nothing. This problem is not so definitive. Things can be interpreted various ways. I should not have been looking at his computer (which is where I found the stuff he was writing to women before he met met). Maybe I shouldn't have brought up the evidence regarding the spending issues. I kept pressing him for answers because things were not as he represented them. Maybe I was too invasive and drove him away? Maybe it was ME? I don't think so, but in his mind I'm sure he doesn't think he did anything wrong either. The only difference is that I am willing to talk about it and I can even admit things that I have done and take responsibility for them. I know that what happened 14 years ago wasn't my fault, but at the time, everyone blamed me as well - now in hindsight, I'm exonerated, but I stopped talking to a lot over people over that

I guess I still feel like I'm in an "alternate universe" where everything I knew to be true is not and I don't know what is true. Someone on another board talked about "derealization", so I looked it up and that's what I feel. Like I'm "living in a dream". I guess it's hard to understand if you've never felt like this. I'm still in bed (although I'm now clean and so are my sheets). It's like my bed is the only place I feel "safe" and I don't want to leave it. Just sitting at my desk or going out into my yard makes me panicky. I know it's the PTSD because ever since 14 years ago, I've had it on and off every time something shocking like this happens to me. Therapy and meds never worked in the past. I just have to wait it out and hope it lifts soon. Reading and posting on these web boards is the only activity which relieves some of the misery I am feeling.

Thank you, all of you, so much for taking the time to communicate with me. Just two months ago, I was such a "hotshot" - driving around a new city like I had been there all my life, meeting new people and looking forward to my future and now I just need to be "rescued" from my fate. Oh, geez, now I'm starting to cry again. I feel like the bipolar one. He's during surgeries and just got back from Mexico and I'm here crying like a stupid little moron and I can't even leave the damn house!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: chattycathy,

quote:

preparation

G

What sort of preparation do you mean when you say "BP's can be scarily convincing if the Non-BP has not gathered their facts in preparation"? What kinds of things do I need to prepare?

I've read through these posts and can't describe how relieved yet sad I felt as I read them.

I have just been 'left' by my boyfriend of 3 years. Actually our relationship history is much longer than that. We've had something for the past 12 years. When I met him he told me stories of how he'd been married before and that his first wife had been killed by a drunk driver. He had a 2 year old daughter when I met him and he said he was seperated and getting a divorce. He told me he had a degree and went on to tell me so many things that I later found out were all untrue. But he won me over by his vulnerability...same as so many of you have described. He showed so much emotion and I just felt an attachment immediatly.

We had a fun, exciting and very sexual relationship for many months. Over that time I learned from his parents that most of the things he told me were lies. They told me he'd done this before. I was so upset. I was only 25 at the time and was so inexperienced with relationships. I ended up confronting him about the lies and he at first denied it. Later he opened up about it and seemed upset. i cant remember if he apologized or not. Once that happened though he started to see other women. He'd be detached and cold. We had times where we wouldn't speak but he'd always come back or call.

There were times we'd be together just the two of us. Then he left on a 2 week trip for work and met someone while he was gone. He lied about that relationship and continued to see me. He also went out with a few other people. He eventually had to move away because he got a DUI and told everyone he had to move with that girl he'd met because that where his DUI was.

I took that opportunity to move forward with my career and started doing really well. He'd call and email me and tell me he missed me and wanted to see me. I always fell for it.

He moved back and brought her with him. We went to college together and had every class together. She had no idea. We continued to be friends with a sexual relationship.

I finally decided I had to move on. I took a job in another state. He later moved to another state with her. To be closer to his daughter he said. He got married...the girl he was with asked him. He said he felt trapped and did it.

Again he stayed in contact with me and we got together several times over the years. I met someone and lost contact with him for a little over a year.

We started talking again and he convinced me he'd changed. He had a great job, was working on his masters, owned a home. But said he had never gotten over me after all of those years. This was about 9 years from the time we met.

I was torn...he told me she was seeing someone else and they were getting divorced. I met him in another city and we spent 3 of the most amazing days in my life together. Very emotional and loving and just everything I'd ever wanted. It was so hard to leave.

Things were intense from then on. She moved out, they filed for divorce...and later bankruptcy. That was a problem to me. He also filed bankruptcy from the other divorce. He's been divorced 3 times and bankrupt 2 times.
I started to pull away...it was a red flag and I didnt want to get caught up. He convinced me it was related to medical bills. She had an aneurism (sp) earlier and many surgeries.

I stayed...we visited every weekend, talked on the phone, emailed, IMd, webcam...everything he'd send me letters, cards, text messages professing his love and admiration and happiness. It was so intense. I loved it.

Eventually (year later) he sold his house and I bought one in my state. We picked it out together and had it built. His house sold while ours was being built. He moved out here and moved in together. Within 3 months he had a fit. He thought I was hiding something from him about a friend. He broke everything he owned and threw stuff away, broke the windows in his truck. Cut himself. Said he was hurting. I was so angry and scared. I held him and told him everything was ok but he needed to go to counseling. He said he would and the next day he called and started to see a Psychiatrist. He went once a week for about a month or two. He did really well after he started seeing her. But then it changed and he said I had changed and that I had distanced myself from him. I had because I was afraid of what would come next but I stayed because I loved him. We had a good year following. We had occasional arguments about lying or cheating. i found that he'd created accounts online and was talking to women he knew from his past. Ones he had only a sexual connection to. He denied it. He would check my email, phone, etc. He was always convinced I was doing something or someone was after me. It made me crazy but I always saw it as him loving me so much that he couldn't imagine me with someone else.

Alot of time went by we went on trips, went to Hawaii...I was close to his family. Then one night out of the blue..a year later...he went to a baseball game with coworkers for a work related event. He was out until 3 am...no calls and didnt answer my calls. When he got home he told me he lost track of time. I told him I didnt believe him. He played the victim and said it was ridiculous I didnt trust him. I slept in the other room. The next 2 nights he came home at 7pm. Every single other day for the 2 years prior he was home by 5:30 so it was weird to me. I asked him where he was. He got very defensive. I let it go and figured I was making it more than it was.
We went with my family to visit my grandparents that weekend. He didn't want to have sex while we were gone. Said he didnt want to do that then have me jumping all over him about cheating when he had never cheated.
The day we returned from the trip he came in the bedroom pissed off and said he was done and moving out. He said I didnt trust him and he was tired of being accused of something he hadnt done. He packed up almost all of his stuff. Then sat and talked with me a little. I cried and asked him to talk to me. He said he wasnt happy and needed to take time to find himself and a purpose in life. Said he needed to find what makes him happy. Said I didnt make him happy. He left...and told me to give him time while he saw a counselor. That lasted for about a week. Then he came to the house while I was gone and got the rest of his stuff and left his cell phone. He wasnt answering it anymore anyways.
He's been very cold and detached. Told me he wasn't in love with me anymore and was moving forward to find happiness.
Friday he told me he'd moved in with a 25 yr old from work that has a newborn baby.

I'm devastated. My friends and family dont understand what it's been like. They all tell me to just not think about him.

I have wracked my brain trying to figure out what I did wrong. My friend suggested looking at BP. I read through this forum and cried because it reminded me so much of him.

I do love him. I know he has a problem. I was willing to go to counseling, therapy, help him with meds...anything. I'm having a hard time accepting that he just stopped loving me so suddenly since it was always so intense.

He would never accept that he has anything. When he went to counseling a few years ago after that outburst he told me he was afraid he was bipolar. His grandmother is and sometimes I think his mom is.

I want him to get help. He tells me nothing was planned for him to leave and that he never cheated on me with this girl. He says they just got along well and this makes him happy. She has no idea who he truely is.