Bipolar Depression

I am struggling with my daughter so much. She has been adhd since she was 2, she was kicked out of daycare at 3 for hitting, biting and kicking. When she was 5 she was finally put on Aderall, didn't work. She was put on Concerta. It helped for awhile but then Clonodine was added to help her sleep. Then risperdal to calm down the angry outbursts. She now is 8 and we've struggled through school (constant phone calls, letters of concern etc..) We just recently took her to another Dr. that suggested it could be bi-polar. Is it bipolar or is it that she's a rotten kid? She is now on Trileptal, 450 mg a day. She still takes Clonodine and risperdal with it and we were told she could stay on the concerta until the Trileptal kicked in completely. I don't know how long it takes to work but it's been 2 weeks and I haven't seen too much of a difference yet. We cut down on her concerta because she was picking at sores repeatedly. But the Dr. said the concerta didn't stay in the system...it was a day to day thing.
Well I got a call from the school counselor in June saying my daughter threatened suicide and that she told her how she'd do it. Today I told her "no" twice and she threatened to hurt herself enough to go to the hospital, and then threatened suicide twice. How do I deal with that? Do I need to call someone? Do I just pretend she didn't say it? What do I do??
I'm getting so depressed. I love my daughter yet sometimes I can't stand her. My husband and I can't go anywhere because we can't find a babysitter for her. We have no family here. I decided to stay at home with her for the summer thinking that might make it better and there's been no change it seems. I just feel so lost and depressed feeling like my life will never be normal. My daughter doesn't have any friends, she's alienated all of them or maybe their parents. But two of the girls live right behind us and my daughter sees them out on their trampoline and she's not invited. It just crushes me to see her so sad and I know she doesn't have any self esteem and then I get so angry. I'm sorry I'm rambling but I don't know anyone with kids that act like mine. I have looked for support groups here and there are 4 I think but they're an hour away. If anyone has any comments or suggestions I would appreciate them. I'm just struggling with the fact that she could be bipolar yet I can't believe any child can be that spoiled.
Thank you for reading.

Have you given thought that perhaps it is the medication she is taking that is now causing the suicidal ideation and impulse? You said she just got put on trileptal, is still on risperdal and clonodine, and still on concerta though reduced, right?

Have you really ever looked up all the individual medications to see if any have a potential to cause aggressiveness, altered mood states, anger, agitation, irritability, psychosis, mania, depression, suicidal thought, etc..? If your daughter is threatening suicide, it should be taken seriously and needs to be reported to her prescribing and providing doctor and therapist (you didn't say if she had a child therapist).

Finally, that last sentence of struggling with the thought of Bipolar but you can't believe she could be that spoiled; uhm, that hopefully wasn't worded the way it came out. Bipolar doesn't equal spoiled or entitled nor does it equal rotten.

Look into the medications as to possible side effects and adverse reactions, inform her provider and therapist of her suicidal behavior and thought patterns. Sometimes the medications prescribed for certain symptoms cause more symptoms than they are designed to alleviate or worsen the ones they were designed for, each person handles medication differently.

Hello there.
Yes she has a child therapist and also a PMHNP.
The PMHNP she recently saw is our new one, (the last one had treated her for 2 years and she wasn't getting any better), said she should never have been put on zoloft and we removed that from the list.
She has threatened suicide before switching medication, she has threatened suicide 4 years ago before even on ANY medications, but it seems it's only when she can't get her way. I am hoping it changes as the new meds are applied differently and I am keeping a journal of behavior.
As for how it was worded about wether she's a "rotten kid" or bipolar, I only ask because some spoiled kids do act this way, and some bipolar kids don't.
I'm so frustrated and lost that I asked this question with a good heart. I am frustrated with the system. I have read The Bipolar Child and my daughter fits some of the symptoms but she seems to be a toned down version of what I've read about, a lot of those seem the extreme. I just want to sit and cry somedays about the constant upheaval in our house. We're all at our wits end.
I will check into the medications. I just agree that she needs a mood stabilizer and definitely something to help with her adhd.
Thank you for replying. It's VERY appreciated.

Have you, by chance, had a chance to speak with a therapist for yourself? All this stress and chaos can bring on some serious depression for the mom's and dad's as well and also a therapist for you can not only help you through this but also maybe give some pointers on how to handle your child's behavior.

Another thing about Bipolar, that is if she does actually have Bipolar is that Bipolar is different for each person. Not everyone is going to have the extreme symptoms the books illustrate. There are, at least for we adults, different levels of the disorder.

You are her parent and you have to be her advocate. Trust me, there are not many things similar to emotional turmoil. It's is often very intense and very quietly internal. It's the outward response to the pain inside that folks see and get and generally, the outward doesn't really match the level of the inward.

If you think a mood stabilizer might help, would be something to discuss. Yet, please take her threats seriously. She may not fully understand what she is saying or feeling and only reacting to the pain and anger but in that kids can be very spontaneous and unpredictable sometimes - just please take her threats seriously.

Tanneuby1

I have dealt with the same issues. My daughter tho is self destructive to her self and she is just about to turn 9. She has threatened suicide. Actually grabbed a knife which she had to climb to get to. She has put things around her throat. I have a few suggestions for you! Find one Therapist that you feel comfortable with. Give them all the information that you can about her. All her paper work! Then Get a case manager for her! They can help you get what is called Personal Care Attendent. This is the only way I get things done in my home! She will qualify for it dont worry. The more you give into her behaviors the more she will act out! I found that one out the hard way! So if you tell her no she cant have something or do something she is going to rebel its called Oppositional Defiance Disorder! You just need to be tough on her and put her in her place. If that means putting her in her room for time out then do it. The other thing is she should not have any toys around her that she can use to harm her self or others. Trileptal can take up to 60 days to fully enter the system because it takes time to build in the system and it takes a while for the doctors to get the does right. Don't even think to your self she is rotten kid. Cause she isn't she just doenst know how to express her anger or any other emotion at this age. Any type of stress can set children with bipolar off. If you are stressed most likely she is feeling it too which could be why she is acting out more then normal.

Thank you both so much for your replies. I hadn't gotten one in so long I forgot all about my post!
I live in Oregon so I'm not sure about the personal care attendant thing but boy I sure could use one. My husband and I are completely exhausted with her. The last two days have been a war we just aren't winning. She is absolutely out of control. Not tantrums. Literally screaming in our faces. She's on quite a few medicatios, Risperdal, Clonodine, trileptal, daytrana. They seem to help at school most of the time. But at home she is awful to deal with. We haven't heard the wanting to kill herself lately, but instead she says things like "i wasn't born right"..."maybe I shouldnt have been born". Its so difficult sometimes. I feel guilty for disliking my own daughter so much. I wish I could love her more instead of always saying no, don't do that, don't use that tone of voice with me, don't break that, etc. Thank you for your posts. She is seeing a great mental health nurse practioner (which is what is normal here in Oregon). And she is seeing a counselor as well. We need to eventually find her more help because it's just not doing the trick.
Thank you again for your responses.

Hi there

I was just reading these last few posts. I live in BC Canada. I am a child care consultant, and I have worked with children and families for over 30 years. I am not a doctor or a nurse. I have a lot of training in early childhood education and counselling skills. Just a bit of history .. no expert, though. My husband was recently diagnosed bp2 (we are in our 50s), and my son was ADHD (he is now 32). So, I am not a parent of a bp child. However, I just want to say, that the timeout approach does not work for these children (prob not much for any children, as latest research shows it is more detrimental than anything). I know 80% of pediatricians still recommend it, and I know Nanny 911 does it. But, really, it does not work. The child will sit and dwell in her room, and get angrier and angrier and feel totally misunderstood. Your goal is to help her calm down,right? Isolation does not do that. Neither does giving in to her intese angers. Proximity is more on the track for any child who is struggling. Stay near her, and keep expressing that you want to help and that you care. I get that you may not feel like that inside. You are tired and angry and don't even like her sometimes. But remember, however much you suffer? she is suffereing more. She is a child, with no life skills. You are the parent with more years of experience behind you, and you are the parent .. so it is your job to help her. This is not alecture, so sorryif it comes off sounding like that. I hope to be helpful. You absoutely need more help than you get, from the sounds of it. You need privacy and space and peace. Time to collect your thoughts and energy. Is there any way you can arrange for time out for yourself? Is she on the right meds for sure? The advice to take her threats to hurt herself, or that she does not feel worth living is very serious. Children are capable of suicide. These statements are her telling you she is very out of control and she cannot help herself, and she needs more help. I know you know all of this.. you are her mom and you know her best of all...and underneath your exchaustion is love for her. My step daughter was diagnosed oppositional defiant as a child, and is now diagnosed bi polar. Her dad (my husband) fought hard for her .. it is still so hard. She still hurts herself, but she does turn to her dad and come to him for stability (which is funny, because he is bp himself, but waymore stable than her). I never raised her, though. I don't know .. I justhope you can keep the idea of 'helping' in mind, rather than 'time out' and helping includes all of you.. post again..if it helps at all..i read here a lot ..

I feel for you in so many ways. My son is 8 and has been on many of the same meds as your daughter. He is also displaying the same behaviors and making the same threats. I wish I had some words of wisdom for you but I am still floundering around trying to figure out what to do as well. My heart goes out to you as I completely understand how frustrating it is. I hope you find something effective for her soon.